This won’t change your mind. But I can’t keep reading these sites and keep my mouth shut.


F2T cosmetic breast removal
F2T cosmetic breast removal

Submitted on 2014/05/28 at 2:57 am
Hi. I figured that you probably don’t read these, but as an philosophy major, I have to say that your analytic approach to everything isn’t working. You really ignore so much of the context. But that’s just my opinion as a Continental. Of course, no system is without its problems, and I can’t say that I know all of the ins and outs of gender theory and philosophy.
I’m a female that is currently considering an FtM transition (I might as well be a devil on this site), and it’s obvious to me that you have never had a real, positive experience with someone transgendered. Maybe you have, but you don’t care. I would assume the latter.
I guess I’m surprised at the adamantine nature of your arguments. Does a lot of this come from radical feminism, which is now what feminism has become in the vernacular? Probably. But I do more for the LGBT community than you probably do. I willingly went to college in the least gay state. I am a lot of kids’ first gay person they met in person. I’m building bridges and I’m helping the straight community come towards acceptance of all. How about you?
It’s people like you and Dirt that make me consider abandoning the gay community. As much as I love the people, I hate the community that to a point almost resists integration. And straight people have always treated me much kinder than I have ever been treated by the rest of the gays. So when I acknowledge that I have no sexual sensation in my erogenous zones and that I might be in a form I have no attachment to, I’m not rushing to run back to the lesbian community.
But I’m taking my time. I’m still learning about what I desire and want from my body. I don’t desire male privileges, I desire comfort. Feeling attractive. Feeling less frustrated that women I like won’t even look at me due to something I hate. I don’t think about becoming a man because it’ll fix my problems. I think about it because I feel that that’s already who I am, and my body is not assisting me with those desires.
This won’t change your mind. But I can’t keep reading these sites and keep my mouth shut. I know the drill; don’t like, don’t post, but who listens to that anyway?
May you live in an interesting time for your community.
[From a comment left by “Orin Conrad” on TransgenderTropes. Images added by me- GM]

42 thoughts on “This won’t change your mind. But I can’t keep reading these sites and keep my mouth shut.

  1. I can’t imagine having a positive experience with anyone who is invested in taking a knife to his or her crotch, or her breasts. Because it just fucking breaks my heart that this culture drives anyone to want to do such things to themselves, for reasons of gender enforcement.
    When I was a liberal I briefly saw the attraction of having my breasts cut out. So this kind of thing is even more painful to address.

  2. The self loathing is palpable… heartbreaking. What a disconnect between the body and mind, between the self and community. I’m at a genuine loss for words.
    Despite the “Chinese” curse OP closed her letter with, I wish her nothing but the best. Sad.

  3. ‘I have to say that your analytic approach to everything isn’t working’
    In other words, stop being so logical.
    This is a disturbing post, filled with internalised misogyny and lesbophobia, but also a detachment that seems to speak of a radical alienation from self on the part of the author.
    Dirt has movingly chronicled the way growing up in a female- and lesbian-hating world produces this in many young lesbians, and now mutilation, testosterone poisoning and further alienation from self is being proffered by the trans cult and their sponsors, Big Pharma, as a ‘cure’.
    The tragic thing is that feminist analysis already points the way out of the torture chamber of gender for sex-role non-conforming girls and women, but such analysis – developed by generations of brilliant and rebellious women – is being deliberately marginalised by ‘progressives’.

    1. I wish more people understood that particularly justice focused people aren’t actually going by feelings, they’re going by logic.
      Being all fuzzy-wuzzy is what just plain does not work, it can lead to standing back and allowing someone to hurt themselves when they actually desperately needed someone to intervene, which is NOT true kindness.
      It’s just really sad to see. She does seem to have a lot of internalised lesbophobia, and even if her straight friends treat her respectfully it sounds like she feels like she has to conform to gain that acceptance. I can’t help but think it would be better for her if she had a community of supportive, strong, lesbian feminists around her, not the trans community egging her on down this path. Many young trans people (the ones who aren’t just autogynophiles, I mean) sound like they suffer from depression, and the assumption always seems to be that it stems from their status as trans, but actually from my own experiences with depression I think it may well be the other way round. If society won’t accept you as you are it’s only natural to be more likely to become depressed, and feel desperate for acceptance, and for it to become harder to accept yourself, too. Which can become a vicious cycle that actually makes it harder to find those people who would accept you as you are.
      They unfortunately also do tend to sound a bit, hmm, lacking in awareness of just how common some of what they’re feeling is. Plenty of women could relate stories of not feeling comfortable in their bodies and with how other people treated them because of their bodies, that would be pretty damn hard to distinguish from many FtT narratives. Crushing on someone who doesn’t like you back is pretty normal too I’d have thought, it’s just worse for her because she’s gone and surrounded herself with straight women who aren’t ever going to like her back. If I could tell the poster of the comment something, it would be that she’s not alone, and she can come to accept herself as she is. Really. Perhaps many in society still won’t, but some will, and as for the ones that don’t? Fuck ’em. You could shred yourself up trying to please them and they won’t care, nothing could make it worth it. I know we women are trained to try, but you just can’t please all of the people all of the time, and trying costs us too much of ourselves.

      1. @Leo – Absolutely agree with you when you say
        “They unfortunately also do tend to sound a bit, hmm, lacking in awareness of just how common some of what they’re feeling is. Plenty of women could relate stories of not feeling comfortable in their bodies and with how other people treated them because of their bodies, that would be pretty damn hard to distinguish from many FtT narratives. “
        I have thought this SO many times myself too. There’s this idea out there now that somehow those of us women who aren’t trans must somehow be magically comfortable in our skins, never feel that we are ugly, or unaccepted, or feel intense unease at puberty due to loathing for the meaning that our maturing bodies are taking on. Somehow we’re just supposedly to all be placid cows blandly accepting of it all, and happy for puberty and the sex roles forced on us and everything else – because if we weren’t, then surely we’d be special and trans too!
        …it’s nuts.

      2. It really is bizarre, isn’t it?
        I wonder if it’s because of internalised misogyny, that maybe they’re only focusing on a specific type of woman – the one who is able to meet the patriarchal ideal? Not that those women don’t suffer too, they absolutely do, but it’d be easier to assume they didn’t. And we all know how women who aren’t like them get invisibilised.

  4. Oh noes! An analytical discussion of things! FUCK ANALYSIS! SCIENCE DON’T REAL. BRAIN SEX!!!!1111
    A devil? When has anyone here ever given shit to the FtT? I’ve never seen any of us express hatred. I’ve seen empathy and critical analysis. Oh wait! Analysis! Analysis is the anti-Christ!
    She does more for the LGBT community?
    Like any of us here fucking care.
    I don’t want anything to do with the Trans toxicity. Their movement is dangerous to me as a woman and lesbian.
    If trans is not a sexual orientation then why are they part of a movement for the rights of homosexuals (or people in homosexual relations)? There’s more that the ONE movement for social change.
    People throughout history have been fighting for change for their own people. Get your own movement.
    Surprised by our adamant nature? Because us wimminz gotta be compliant. We aren’t allowed to take a hard-line on the absolute bullshit from trans.
    E.g. “It’s not a penis, it’s only a penis if I identify it as a penis. If you don’t have sex with me, you’re a transmisogynist.”
    She willingly went to college in a gay state. What’s the fucking point of that statement? Seriously, that’s activism? Activism is going to school in a difficult place.
    I chose to go to public school in High School. FUCKING ACTIVISM WHOOOOOO
    How does she build bridges? By burning her own people?
    “I’m not a lesbian, I’m a heterosexual ‘man’”- further cementing the idea that gay people are just “confused” or “in the wrong bodies”. As a lesbian, I’m so fucking thrilled by her courage to adhere to stereotypes.
    Straight acceptance? WHO FUCKING CARES? Does anyone think anti-gay heterosexuals really give a fuck about us?
    We shouldn’t be trying to curry favour with them.
    If people in 2014 are so fucking dense that they still don’t recognise homosexuals as people deserving of rights then why would I even want their fucking acceptance?
    FUCK THOSE PEOPLE. I got other shit to worry about.
    People like Gallus and Dirt are the ones who have the problem. It’s THEIR fault she’s unhappy.
    Just like all those stupid bitches that wouldn’t sleep with Elliot Rodger.
    If only the community would integrate. If only the gay community would SHUT UP and just DO AS TRANS SAYS!
    She desires comfort. Yes, because that’s not a universal human yearning at all.
    She desires desire. She wants people to like her, yeah…human trait.
    “Feeling less frustrated that women I like won’t even look at me due to something I hate”
    So, she wants to attract straight women then? THE FUCK?
    She gets frustrated that people don’t swoon or have sexual interest in you?
    Jesus, sheltered much? Where do all these people come from that they can’t handle rejection or criticism?
    The Cotton Swaddle district on The Woollen Planet of Hugs?
    Then she goes on to say that it’s isn’t about any of the bullshit she just spewed but because it’s how she’s been her whole life and she “feels” like she’s a man.
    What does that shit even mean? “Feels” like a man.
    Eurrrgh. I need a drink.

    1. “Eurrrgh. I need a drink.”
      Cheers!–“clink.” You deserve it after that keen analysis of Conrad’s comment. Anti-rationality causes misery, so it’s just what the doctor ordered.

    2. “Feeling less frustrated that women I like won’t even look at me due to something I hate”
      The trans insistence that they want people to go against sexual preference for their benefit is head-scratching. Disgruntled man likes women, so becomes “transwoman” and insists lesbians are obligated to provide sexual access. Disturbed female likes women, so wishes to become a man and gain access to straight women. The entitlement is staggering.

  5. “it’s obvious to me that you have never had a real, positive experience with someone transgendered. Maybe you have, but you don’t care. I would assume the latter.”
    She doesn’t have to engage with your facts and ask whether they’re right or wrong, and she doesn’t have to ask whether your conclusions based on those facts are justified or not, because it’s enough to assume – her words! – that you don’t care, and that if you’d had a positive experience with a trans person, then you wouldn’t think the way you do.
    If we all go out and have a real, positive experience with a trans person, will that mean Christopher “Jessica” Hambrook didn’t assault women in women’s shelters?
    Will it mean Colleen Francis didn’t expose his penis to little girls in a changing room?
    Will it mean kids aren’t diagnosed with GID and treated with untested drugs because they like the “wrong” toys?

    1. Good questions, born free.
      We could ask the same questions about men in general. For instance, I know a woman who has a brother who has a wife who has a hairdresser who is the kindest guy you’ll ever meet. Wouldn’t hurt a fly, and gives generously every year to a local battered women’s shelter. So, I guess male violence is irrelevant? ‘Cause everyone has real, positive experiences with this guy, so apparently no feminist analysis of male violence is necessary.

  6. “Feeling less frustrated that women I like won’t even look at me due to something I hate.”
    I appreciate your honest and direct comments. I’m a feminist from the way-back, and long- lapsed het. I knew a powerful dyke whom our University tried to bamboozle into F2T surgery in the late 1960;s. She took the T, but she stopped at the top surgery, wondering why she could not be Big Bold Dyke and Proud without mutilating herself. She lived many years – an entertainer and a youth advocate – the most loving person I think I’ve ever known. I think of her when I read your story, as she grew into a giant oak tree of proud lesbian and even started a free health clinic for women and children in a poor neighborhood.
    Coming to love and appreciate ourselves is a very long journey. Hating our bodies due to a socially-constructed gender identity troubles me – the particulars of these so-called jendah realities have become even more adamantine over the decades.
    In life, MOST of the people we desire will not ever look back at us. For a variety of reasons of their own choosing. From my reading, I’ve gathered that sometimes a post-op person has even fewer choice of partners of either sex than before their “transition”. I think its just cosmetic surgery – a giant body lift of sorts – not “transition” because one can NEVER change their biological sex DNA.
    It took me decades to learn to love and accept myself – and I wish that for you.
    I think its fine to become a transgender. My problem is when the transgender appropriates a biological sex – the M2T with penis who endanger my community of sisters and daughters and demand status of XX even while dangling a penis. My other problem is with M2T who are violent towards gender critical feminists and deliver death and rape threats for biological females even questioning privilege-over my female sex for their fetishes and autogynephilias.
    Having known amazing dykes and lesbians, and they gave off very powerful – what some might call adamantine masculine – vibes. I’m sad to lose these potential Amazons such as yourself to cosmetic surgery, T that will give them acne and paunches and shorten their lives.
    Were you abused as a child?

  7. OP, you’re coming from a very bitter place. It makes you blind to the very obvious possibility that the straight community you feel accepted by might only accept you because your self-hatred is a symbol for the ongoing success of their societal supremacy re: gender.
    What’s more, your success in straight society seems to be conditional on you being one of the “least gay” people around. Your unciritical acceptance and actual celebration of this fact gives them permission to discriminate against those you yourself despise, i.e. the community you hate. Is that your problem? Getting revenge for any (imagined) injury caused by “the rest of the gays” by allying with straight people to cause an “interesting time” as you said in your closing quasi-threat? Yeah, that’s not going to work. You’ll still hate yourself with the knowledge that all those straight people who like you probably do so because you are one of the “least gay”. In this equation you’re not the winner but the loser.
    But what’s your problem with the lesbian/gay-community anyway? You say that there’s “no sexual sensation in my erogenous zones”. You should have anticipated that this would cause problems in the lesbian community you don’t want to rush back to. You hate being a woman so much that you’re literally not able to have sexual feelings while inhabiting your body. Instead you want straight women to look at you as a MAN. Who would be able to deal with this???
    I think it’s sad that you don’t have the ability to see that your problems are not caused by “the gays” or “lesbians” but by 1) the stifling gender norms around you/the very people you seek to be accepted by and 2) your own self-hatred.

    1. Wth, I actually read “least gay state” as being in a state of not seeming gay. That’s what reading academic texts all the time does to you (state = status etc. etc.).
      But I still wonder why someone has to go out of their way to emphasize why they’re so much better than all of us. It’s not about being better, OP.

  8. To Orin:
    I think all people desire comfort from their body, and we all in some ways insist that what we are on the outside isn’t necessarily us. My real problem comes when people try and make their body issues a medical problem.
    You want to become a man. No, you want to become the person you claim you already are.
    I want to get taller. I’m a man who is 4’10” (4 inches taller than Peter Dinklage, if you need a reference). I could make the argument that I’m a tall man in a shrimpy body, but there’s no magic medical cure for that. I could have my legs broken and stretched in the hope of gaining a few inches and still being able to walk, but that sounds really unhealthy, doesn’t it?
    I tend to view SRS the same way. The whole brain/biology theory surrounding transsexualism is something I cannot buy at this time. It rings of pseudoscience, which means that, although you may desperately want it, you don’t actually have an intersex condition between your mind and body. It seems like you have identity issues (we all have those to some degree), and you seem desperate to fit in somewhere. However, would you go under the knife for it?
    If you find the idea that some dwarfs and short people willing elect to have their bones broken and slowly, painfully mended in hopes of a few extra inches repulsive then do you not also find the idea of chopping off your breasts, creating a fleshy dildo from your forearm or thigh, and having to take synthetic hormones (which aren’t healthy) for the rest of your life to keep up appearances also repulsive?
    I should also warn you that the hormone given to FtMs is usually cypionate, a steroid most bodybuilders prefer to avoid. It’s loaded with DHT (the hormone that makes beard and body hair grow, but also results in scalp hair loss), and many people report hair loss and aging as the result of taking it.
    You might think that, seeing as how you don’t produce large amounts of testosterone to begin with, that the steroid won’t produce these effects in you. However, many FTMs are bald after about a decade on the hormone. It is specifically chosen for its high DHT content to get the body changing faster, helping the ladies who do this to pass sooner.
    I’m an individualist, first and foremost. Our strengths, weaknesses, and personalities are not derived, for the most part, from our brains and biology. Being black doesn’t automatically make you a better basketball player, Asians aren’t naturally smarter, and whites aren’t naturally conquerors and invaders.
    In that same vein, men aren’t naturally logical, evil, patronizing, stoic, even-tempered, or any other stereotype that you can thrust on us. Women aren’t naturally hysterical, emotional (more than men, I mean), empty-headed, picky, or great multitaskers.
    These traits are brought out by culture, by hierarchy, by our very language. Be yourself, in the body that you have. If you don’t respect your body, how do expect anyone else to do the same?
    If you’re unhappy by having people thrust feminine traits onto you, or make assumptions, then become an activist! Assert your individuality and work to change peoples’ perceptions of your sex.
    It seems that you’re turned off by the gay community. I can’t really comment on that, seeing as how I’m asexual (although the people here are usually friendly enough), and not very involved in my community, but is it really so bad that you want to transition into a straight, pseudo-male?
    We all want to be taller, shorter, older, younger, more capable, more masculine, more feminine, whiter, darker, etc. However, biology doesn’t necessary work in our favor. Instead of wasting your money, your time, and your life trying to change the things about your body that you don’t like, why not learn to accept it?
    It also helps to think about other people as well. We’d all love to relentlessly pursue our own selfish endeavors, but we affect a lot of other people in the process. What about your parents? Do you have a girlfriend? Any siblings? Do their feelings matter as much as yours, or, if they’re unhappy, is it just something that they have to “get over” whilst you go about your merry way?
    There’s a huge differences between coming out as gay and coming out as transsexual, in my opinion. You should think about that a bit.
    This probably hasn’t changed your mind, but hopefully it has given you something to think about. I know that this isn’t a decision you’re just rushing into, but it’s still a huge undertaking.

    1. I had a gigantic nose. I had a nose job and now my quality of life is much higher. Should i not have had a nose job and instead just accepted my body?

      1. To nose-job or not to nose-job is your choice, ted – it’s your nose, after all. And still – for personal amusement – you might be moved to embark on an analysis of just why the size of said nose came to be such a BIG DEAL in your eyes…

    2. Seconded that that was a very kind response, Akira. : )
      It frustrates me when it becomes treated as a medical problem, too – my body image issues all stem from my medical problem, so it really hurts to think of people feeling like they have to mess with their perfectly healthy bodies.
      I wondered about that too, her seeming turned off by the gay community. It’s partly internalised lesbophobia I guess, but I kind of wonder if she’s just been around the wrong sections of it for her, maybe if she’s a more reserved person who isn’t comfortable with things like Pride parades etc?
      I’m asexual too, and I’m ashamed to confess, from what I’d seen of the younger gay community previously, they just seemed like any other irritating sexual people – likely to give me a headache because I just can’t handle how focused on sex sexual people are, their total lack of a filter (please please don’t tell me about your sex life with no warning…), and how hypersexualised our current society is. The way many lesbian feminists talk about sexuality is totally different to that, it’s more, well intimate and personal, I really had no idea. That kind of attitude is just so much easier to relate to, even for me as asexual (so it still doesn’t really compute, but still). Since she mentions she doesn’t feel sexual, maybe she’s just not comfortable with it, with the specific way society expects her to be sexual, and that might be part of the issue?

      I would add something/change something in it:
      You wrote that everyone wants to be something different, ‘taller, shorter, older, younger, etc.’
      The thing that’s important to realize is that a lot of that comes from society, not from ourselves. Women who want to be men don’t nec. want penises, they want to be treated equally to men.
      People who want to be taller, often have the idea that taller people have better lives, are more sexually attractive, etc.
      People who want to be older often want the rights that adults have but kids’ don’t (eg. right to vote, right to drive a car), or to be treated with respect (even as an adult by LAW, a lot of adults treat me as a kid, and it’s insulting).
      The issue isn’t nec. the person, it’s the society. Would transgendered people even exist if gender didn’t? Probably not. Would body dysmorphic disorder exist if we didn’t have a society that tells everyone they are ugly/etc.? I doubt it.

    4. ‘These traits are brought out by culture, by hierarchy, by our very language. Be yourself, in the body that you have. If you don’t respect your body, how do expect anyone else to do the same?’
      I wouldn’t dispute that, yet nor do I believe ALL ‘typically male/female’ traits are entirely learned.There are propensities that remain remarkably constant over time, across cultures and even species. The latter strikes me as especially significant: even when violence is typically – or even exclusively – the provenance of the female, such as in the case of the spotted hyena or the praying mantis it serves to reinforce the notion of a universal male/female dichotomy.
      Humans are simply, perhaps, better-equipped to express this, and make analyses – for all the good it does us: our males continue to be predictably and unambiguously violent.

  9. “it’s obvious to me that you have never had a real, positive experience with someone transgendered. Maybe you have, but you don’t care. I would assume the latter.”
    Translation: “your analysis of genderism is, to my transgender ears, meaningless noise; so, my conclusion is that you’re just a bunch of mean, stupid women.”
    This, and the rest of Conrad’s comment, is pure aggression. Note also the hallmarks of spiteful narcissism. I can feel pity for someone who hates her own female body, but I cannot commiserate with anyone who is using emotional manipulation and other dirty tactics from the abuser’s toolkit.

  10. I have to disagree with this person’s entire philosophical premise. I was a philosophy major once (a long time ago). I also disliked analytic philosophy and veered toward the “continental” thinkers. I don’t know how you get from there to her conclusions though. A continental thinker would be the first to tell you that there is no “essence” apart from your “being/doing” in the world. What she suggests is not “continental” philosophy but magical thinking, a kind of solipsism that imagines that “reality” is nothing more than what I imagine in my head. And then only at this particular moment.

  11. “We’d all love to relentlessly pursue our own selfish endeavors, but we affect a lot of other people in the process.”
    All? Men are like that. Women, not so much.

    1. I’d say that it’s part of the human condition. The point is that people are selfish, and it’s important to take others into consideration before you run off and mutilate yourself, regardless of your man-brain or laydee-brain’s tendency towards selfish pursuits (or lack thereof).

      1. The human condition for men or the human condition for women? They are not one and the same. Especially considering that the default human is deemed male. The words “human” and “people” are used to gloss this over and to enable the women-do-it-toooo justifications.

  12. We used to say that an army of lovers cannot be defeated. I used to believe that we were such a force. You, trans, have NOT done more for the ‘community’ than anyone else here has. In fact, you are performing the one act that will break us in the end. You are admitting that you are not, in fact, ‘gay.’ You were just born into the ‘wrong body’.
    You are telling us all that we’ve been making a terrible mistake. If we all just jumped on your little red wagon and admitted that we aren’t lesbians at all, just het males somehow born female, all would be well. No need for ‘gay’ at all.
    Go cut off your breasts. Give the man the money. In twenty or thirty years, when someone asks you what happened, I wonder what you’ll say?

  13. Orin
    First of all, as a graduate student and occasional undergraduate essay-sifter, I would say you need to be very careful about claiming the kind of expertise in your field which you allude to in calling yourself ‘a Continental’, and also that you do not in fact get a better grade in either the academy or the real world for throwing big words into your sentences in a clunky manner. I know your favourite philosophers like to construct five-page sentences with multiple uses of ‘heteronomy’ and ‘idiomatic’, but in real communication clarity is preferable to the thesaurus.
    Secondly, I am sorry that you seem to feel such a strong identification with heterosexuality that you would rather your desire for women be that of a heterosexual man than that of a lesbian.
    I know what it’s like to feel as if you are ‘really a man inside’- that your needs and wants and interests and thoughts are so far from what you believe are what women care about, that your body feels strange and awkward and not congruent with your sense of self, that you can’t even begin to imagine a woman caring for you and loving you as you are. I know what it’s like to want out of your femaleness, to be a person and not just a thing. I know what it’s like to feel like parts of your physical self are just wrong, to have your mind create phantom sensations of body parts that aren’t there.
    You are not a ‘man inside’ because ‘man’ or ‘woman’ are not things that anybody is inside. Everyone is a person inside. We just live in a society where being a person and being a man are considered to be the same thing, and being a woman means being some variety of object. There is nothing wrong with you exactly as you are. There is nothing about who you are that surgery and artificial hormones can make more real.
    Surgery and artificial hormones are also not a guarantee that the kinds of women you like are going to start liking you. Finding love is hard for anyone, and it can be extra hard as someone attracted to the same sex when society tries to keep us from one another and tries to make us as hurt and damaged as it can. But it is still possible for all of us. Weeds grow through the thickest concrete.
    At the very least I urge you to hold off for now on pursuing medical transition, and please take the time to listen to the voices of women who have been down the road you are on and decided to come back- there are several of them listed on Gallus’s blogroll and they are all thoughtful and intelligent women.

  14. Your story is heartbreaking, I do know transgender people and I bear them (and you) no ill will. Do you know many? Do they have the happiness you seek? I do think it’s tragic that you think that exogenous testosterone and a mastectomy is a solution to your obvious lack of self-esteem or to your lack of sexual sensation. Yes, straight people undoubtedly approve of your lesbophobia and offer you “acceptance.” But do you really think that the key to getting women to “look at you” is a mutilated body? Please consider therapy — and not from a “gender therapist” eager to collude with you. YOU HATE YOURSELF. Address that first. You are perfect as you are, even with your dissatisfaction and sex dysphoria and despair. Self-acceptance is a struggle for all women in this society, but it is possible. All the best. To me, you will never be anything but a woman who is hurting.

  15. Sorry, but when people describe themselves as continental I can’t think of anything but that Christopher Walken sketch on SNL. And you didn’t even offer us any cham-pah-nyah.
    Frankly, if this pomojazz is the fruit of cutting-edge European thought, cue Lee Greenwood.
    Just kidding, I know we’re in it up to our necks here too.

  16. you went to college in the least gay state, surrounded yourself with het ppl, some of whom have never met ‘a gay’ and somewhere along the line learned to hate not just your womanhood, but also your lesbianism, SHOCKER. what do you say you spend some time at a university or community that isnt in the least gay place evah and see how you feel about yourself when you arent treated like some token curiosity by everyone around you. Give it a try before you go under the knife. In some places with larger lesbian communities, you may find other women who share some of your troubles and have still learned to love themselves, as opposed to the 5 lesbians you’ve met on campus, not a great sample size when you’re looking for diversity of experience, in the ‘least gay state’. Kudos for the activism, if thats what you want to call it, but honestly, what did you expect?

  17. I doubt that heteroSEXUAL women will be attracted to her. Yes at the first glance it’s possible. But you can’t change your entire body. So when the clothes come off people will notice that something isn’t right/is different. And someone who isn’t attracted to female bodies/body parts will refuse to go further.

  18. I’m ″continental″ too, and not for the life of mine I see what that would change in terms of ″context″.
    I don’t know what the ″least gay state″ is, Russia? Poland? Armenia? Turkey? Whatever it is, this woman’s ″outreach″ to the straight community (one could say the sucking up to the hets) is doing exactly nothing for Lesbians and gay men.
    Apparently this woman is convinced that people magically stop hating gays (where are the Lesbians?) when they meet one in the flesh. If that worked, there wouldn’t be any homophobic people throwing out their Lesbian or gay children in the streets; I wouldn’t get vicious left-field attacks out of the blue from family members and long-term friends who seemed so accepting and tolerant as soon as I say something they don’t like; family priests wouldn’t add their share of homophobia; and there would be significantly less corrective rape (since victims often know the rapist beforehand).
    You know what? You can suck up to the straight community as much as you want. It will not get you anywhere, no matter how much of you you have cut up to please them.

  19. must wonder.. we see female genital mutilation as horrible, and we’re starting to see circumcision the same way.. and yet trans surgery is’t seen as self-mutilation (though cutting is), and is being pushed on kids.

  20. Hi. My name is kade Patterson. im from kentucky. I guess yall can call me alyssa.. I dont take it personal. Im a trans man. Pre everything. I aint as intelligent as you guys using all these big words but I understand clearly the point your trying to make. And before I go on I just wanna say I admire that u guys feel so strongly about this issue. Shows u care at least.. just not the way we want u to as trans people. I also will go on to say I think in some cases.. not the majority.. but some.. you are right. Being trans for some people ive met is mostly about acceptance. Because they are not ok with being lesbian.. because of how they were brought up to think. And its not there fault.. I feel your being a little harsh on that subject. But anyway. There is no right or wrong opinion. I just wanna share mine with u. Like I said in some cases ur right.. but the other cases… try to explain it. When a small child.. a little boy who likes to be called lucy hates his penis so much he litterally hurts himself trying to detach it from his body. You can say ‘ oh well that is society brain washing him into thinking he has to be female to like males’ but in my opinion.. I think the only thing society has taught him at that age is ‘ who has cooties and who dont’. Also if that is how u see all trans individuals.. as ‘brain washed by society’ then im forced to see everyone who identifies as gay.. as people who have been molested by the oppisite sex and just grew into hating that particular gender. But I dont see it that way because I know that is not always the case. Even though I know sometimes it is. Also how do u explain the gay trans man or the lesbian trans women? How are they brain washed by society? How can u say they are made to think they have to be the oppisite sex to be attracted to the exact sex they feel they already are? Like I said I understand ur veiws.. but I feel your logic is flawed. And as far as the ‘ harmful to ur body’ point of veiw.. then every single one of u with a body modification.. such as a tattoo or peircing.. are in the wrong. Because something made u want that new tat.. it made u feel more attractive or tough.. and u stuck a needle in ur body to get it. This is just my opinion.. some of u not all of u but some.. are hypocrite s. But thats not ur fault. Ur only human. Feel free to disagree. Once again im kade patterson. Im an ftm. U can find me on facebook.. I was raised Jehovah’s witness and society may or may not have influenced me. But either way.. I will do what makes me happy and comfortable reguardless of people who disagree with it. I trust u guys will do the same.

  21. Okay, so I read some articles on Tumblr last night I was horrified to discover that these medical quacks who are mutilating these young women are also putting them on hormones while they still have intact uteruses! WTF!? I’m a 49 year old woman wh talked to my doctor about HRT and she said she only prescribes it for women who’ve had full hysterectomies! The danger to your heart is too high otherwise. Estrogen apparently has a role in protecting a woman’s heart and also the brain. I hadn’t thought about transmen all that much, but I assumed they’d had hysterectomies. What manner of fuckery is this?
    I want to believe that these young women were told the dangers and simply chose to ignore them. I know that in the invicibility of youth it’s easy to do. But the notion that a doctor failed to tell a woman that being on testosterone indefinitely would have detrimental effects on her body is flat out malpractice. In the post I read the young woman’s system had stopped making estrogen altogether and having lost the antibiotic aspects of that hormone she had constant yeast infections and UTIs. Another young women is having a hysterectomy because after 15 years of testosterone her uterus has atrophied and has become chronically infected. How the hell can this be okay.
    I chose to treat my premenopause symptoms with herbs, yoga, diet and moderate exercise. No way am I taking HRT. And barring cancer (God forbid) a hysterectomy is a total nonstarter. And I firmly believe that medicalizing a psychological disorder is malpractice and in some cases flat out child abuse. You treat a psychological disorder with psychological methods, not by puttin very young folk on a hormones and removing their breasts. They run atound screaming about those false suicide statistics. I wonder how many transmen have died from the sctual “treatment.” Their heart attack and stroke risk must be astronomical. To say nothing of early onset Alzheimer’s and diabetes. They must have higher ovarian and cervical cancer rates too. Is no one telling them this? Estrogen is a powerful hormone and crucial to the health and functioning of the female body. It’s not just there to give us soft skin and shiny hair and the way it’s been trivialized by the trans movement is tragic and potentially lethal.

    1. I presume you’re talking about Buck Angel whose uterus atrophied. One appalling thing about that is the implication that Angel wasn’t getting regular pelvic exams, I presume because it was “triggering” or a man shouldn’t have to need that or whatever. And would ovarian cancer rates really increase? It was my understanding that estrogen is more the deciding factor there, many post-breast and -ovarian cancer medications involve suppressing estrogen.

  22. But it’s a balancing act between estrogen testosterone and progesterone (plus a bunch of others). If any of them get out of whack it can elevate your risk for all manner of things. Yes, some cancers feed on estrogen, but by putting in so much testosterone they caused their body to stop making estrogen period. And some cancers feed on testosterone as well. I’d be very surprised if the cancer risk isn’t elevated.

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