Autopsy Reveals Body's Gender, Not Identity

From MSNBC Florida:
ORMOND BEACH, Fla. — The human remains found in Ormond Beach in a trash bag over the weekend were that of a white female between the ages of 20 and 45, an autopsy determined on Tuesday.
A family found the remains near Airport Road.
Police said Tuesday the woman had light brown to dirty blond hair and was around 100 to 115 pounds.
The woman has not been identified, nor has the cause of death.
Authorities said the remains had been placed in the area in the last six months.
Police said no Ormond Beach missing persons cases matche [sic]  the description of the woman.”

UPDATE Feb 11 2011- still unidentified.
March 4 2011- still unidentified.
April 8 2011- still unidentified.
May 15, 2011- still unidentified.
7/11/11- still unidentified.
9/15/2011- still unidentified.
3/05/2012: *UPDATE- The woman has been identified as Pamela Sue Will, 50, reported missing in 2010. From her Daytona Beach News-Journal obituary:


Pamela Sue Will, 50, of Port Orange, who has been missing since September 8, 2010 was found on January 16, 2011. Pam was born in Steubenville, Ohio and was a cashier in a local grocery store. She is survived by her mother, Jo Ann Eller, Port Orange; her brother, Joseph J. Garland; two sisters, Tina Cook and Cindy Marie Vitek. She is also survived by her son, Joshua Milliken; and her daughter, Stephanie Seebach. Pam was a wonderful person and will be missed by all that knew her. A Private Memorial Service will be held at the convenience of the family. Condolences may be shared with the family at Arrangements are under the entrusted care of Cardwell Funeral Home.
The story from the Daytona Beach News-Journal reporter Lyda Longa:
No further information regarding any ongoing investigation has been made available. Thank you to DBNJ reporter Lyda Longa for continued follow up on this story. Hopefully the investigation is ongoing. Updates will continue to be posted here.
My condolences to Pamela’s family and loved ones. Rest in Peace Pamela.

24 thoughts on “Autopsy Reveals Body's Gender, Not Identity

  1. Nitpick: it’s “sex”, not “gender”. Gender, at least in the transgender definition, is social, sex is biological.
    And whoever murdered that woman and threw her body in a plastic bag should have the same treatment on himself (well, because this is most likely a “he”). Well, that’s my instinctual response, then I remember the motto “Eye for an eye makes the world blind” and I get confused :S . Well, lifelong jail at least.

    1. The post title is the actual title of the article referenced. Which I found compelling on several levels and thought readers might too. I have way more to say about this post when I have a bit more time. I kind of agonized over this post- I literally posted it and then put it in the “trash” and then pulled it out of the trash. I know, horrific in context of a post about a woman who was extinguished and dumped like trash. Like so much fucking trash. I’m so fucking angry. Especially about the fact that this isn’t even fucking news, and that two major news sources posted this fucking blurb without even proofreading the fucking thing. There are hundreds if not thousands of femicidal murders like this every day, and it’s all just a big yawn isn’t it. They should call out the National Guard and put all men on curfew and house arrest until it’s all sorted out. But of course they won’t because it’s all to be expected.
      I’ll comment more later on this post.
      And as for “Gender, at least in the transgender definition, is social, sex is biological.” Well that is the big lie isn’t it? If they actually understood that, no transgender person would ever attempt to modify their body (sex) to express their gender. Transgender people would actually subscribe to the same biological science that the rest of the world subscribes to, instead of trying to propagate some nonsensical holocaust denial creationist bullshit like some fucked up fundamentalist religious sect. But they don’t. And they won’t. Gender is the currency of sex based oppression. Social performance of the sex-based caste system. And while feminists recognize that the gender tropes attached to our sex is propaganda from the overlords, we don’t pretend that the conventions stereotypes and gender caste system is somehow divorced from the actual physical sex of those whom it’s enforcement is intended (and does) control= FEMALES. Like Jane Doe in the post above, dumped like trash six months ago.

      1. FUCK YES THIS.
        Sorry I got a swarm of tranny hate mail in my tumblr inbox this morning, and then finding this post, it fucking saddens and sickens me that these fucking delusional wankers think that they are such special snowflakes AND more importantly..
        This womon was made to suffer and that is wrong. wrong.wrong.

    2. I read a Kathy Reichs’ book a few years ago: she’s the author of the series that inspired the TV show, Bones. In the book, it was abundantly clear that she had no idea about the specific meanings of sex vs. gender, and that’s as a forensic anthropologist. No one told her to read a book, get educated, whatever, as far as I know, because she has no intention of making waves when it comes to discussing gender.
      So I’m guessing it didn’t bug her when the TV show writers were even more placating and had her characters act as if a post-op victim had a body that was half female, half male, some sort of hybrid genetic chimera, because they had to treat the evidence of SRS as a 100% factual female reproductive system. Which is mind boggling. But of course the same episode took every opportunity to point out that anyone who didn’t go along with that was a Neanderthal bigot who was in need of education.
      Never mind that the doctor that inspired the show and has sold millions of books seems to lack that same education herself (I’m sure that five years later she’s been properly instructed, of course).

  2. Thank you for this, GallusMag.
    To Bluetraveller: It’s not about “an eye for an eye.” It’s about self defense and knowing how we are linked. When I taught self defense to women and girls, the women were so reluctant to learn a self defense method which would really hurt an attacker — but you don’t have the choice to just slightly injure when dealing with an experienced rapist/murderer who is usually at an extreme advantage in size and a number of ways. When we explained that we are always fighting on behalf of the past and future victims (because you’re not the first and you sure won’t be the last), so keep in mind females you love when fighting back, they really got into it — which also helped with their living in fear after having been assaulted.
    It’s war going on against females. And “life in prison” often means a parole very soon — if they are even ever convicted.
    If every girl or woman were able to kill the boy or man who attacks her (and you never know when it’s “just” rape or attempted murder), few, if any males would be left alive. And that would also save so many other species from extinction.

    1. BevJo, one thing that has always bothered me about self-defense laws is that they assume two opponents of equal size and strength. In my state, there is a requirement that you “retreat to the wall” (retreat until you physically can’t retreat anymore) before using any force, never mind deadly force. And for the latter, you have to have watertight evidence that your life was in immediate danger.
      The real life result of this is that any guy who feels like physically intimidating a woman has carte blanche to do so as long as he can plausibly deny that it was his intention to kill or rape her. I honestly think that Florida, of all places, had the right idea when it extended the “castle doctrine” to one’s personal space in public. (That’s the law that says you don’t have to retreat before using deadly force in your own home.) All my nice liberal friends, especially the male ones, thought that was barbaric. They never had some random guy literally back them against a wall because he didn’t like the way they brushed off his unwanted overtures.

      1. Yes! This, thank you loup-loup. When I got taught self defense in high school we weren’t meant to hit someone in the head or face or use our nails or anything. Very different from the kickboxing I did which rule number one was GO FOR THE HEAD.
        Soft spots = eyes, ears, throat, groin (although most men these days know to cover) nose = win

        If every girl or woman were able to kill the boy or man who attacks her (and you never know when it’s “just” rape or attempted murder), few, if any males would be left alive. And that would also save so many other species from extinction.


  3. “Sex” and “gender” used to be synonyms; both meant biological sex, as in what’s in your pants. In many settings, they still do. The semantic distinction between them (with “sex” referring to biology, and “gender” to social roles) is a recent invention. I do believe that’s one more thing we have Judith Butler to thank for. Although she didn’t come up with the idea of using the word “gender” to mean “social gender only” all by herself, she did the most to popularize it.
    Because of this, there has been a lot of confusion across disciplines for the last 20 years. Lit crit and social science types have been using “sex” and “gender” to mean different things for a long time, but biologists have not. I think it’s only in the last few years that the life sciences have adopted the new definition of gender (gender =/= sex), and it’s not universal.

    1. The problem -the LIE- about divorcing sex from gender is that gender is BASED on the sex caste system. Gender is not only an artifact, but an INVENTION OF male supremacists. And as much as males may want to have more gender CHOICES to play around with, the idea that gender is somehow divorced from worldwide servitude and femicide of women is a total fucking lie.


      2. Also Hexy, after seeing this comment I am not interested in having ANY kind of conversation with you (I got your e-mail before I read this comment of yours.)

  4. Well, the female impersonators can never be with real Lesbians.
    Loup, I know what you mean about the unjust laws. When I taught self defense, we would advise our classes that if they had to seriously injure or kill an attacker, tell the police that he threatened to rob them since property is taken more seriously that a woman’s life.

    1. I bet a financial reward offered for tips in this case would help greatly now that the homicide victim has been identified.

      1. I knew Pam. She was a prostitute and a crack-head but a wonderful person. I have just seen the story about her body being found and I’m sickened by it.
        She lived on the edge because of her addiction and told me she had been raped once, but I never imagined her life would end like this.
        I’m writing this here because it’s the only outlet I’ve found. (I’m not computer savvy.)
        I don’t believe in God, but Pam did, so my only offering is:
        God bless you, Pam

  5. “…the idea that gender is somehow divorced from worldwide servitude and femicide of women is a total fucking lie…”
    Absolutely, 100% correct, GallusMag.
    While “trans women” play at gender, we are victimized by it every, single, fucking day: high heels that destroy our feet and our bones and make it impossible to run from an attacker, “beauty” chemicals applied to the skin that damage it and are absorbed into our systems doing who knows what, fragile and ornamental clothes that make it difficult to be active and athletic, strict diets that deplete our bones of calcium and promote the horrors of osteoporosis, oppressive rules about what “girls” are socially allowed to do (be beautiful, be fuckable, be sweet, be winsome, be submissive, be perky) vs. those traits that “girls” will be relentlessly teased, abused or abandoned for possessing (being “too smart”, being “too sassy”, being “too assertive”, being “too good” at math, being “too good” at hard sciences, being unavailable for sex with men aka being a lesbian, being the best lead guitarist instead of the sexiest back-up singer…)
    Gender is a prison for women. Gender is death for our souls.
    I’ll be damned if I’ll let some sexist, warped, pervy “trans women” shove me back into the gender box that I’ve spent the past 45+ years clawing to escape.

  6. RoseVerbena, that comment is amazing. It really gets to the heart of the matter. Do you mind if I quote part of it on tumblr? I’ve been trying to fight the good fight in that cesspool of misogyny. (When I can be bothered. It’s kind of a hopeless case and I don’t want to waste too much time on it. But they ignited a kind of righteous fury in me with that statement about breaking radfems’ spirits, so I’ll not be completely silenced.) You can find my tumblr blog at .

  7. You said that well, Rose. What other privileged group so revels in caricaturizing those they oppress in an attempt to steal their identity. I always say that if men like shoes that damage feet and toxic chemicals they make for women so much, let them wear them. But I know they’d take our skin too.

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